並前往https://podcasts.apple.com/tw/podcast/ep-42-%E5%BC%B7%E6%82%8D%E5%87%BA%E6%93%8A%E8%AA%B0%E6%80%95%E8%AA%B0-%E6%88%91%E5%80%91%E5%B0%B1%E6%98%AF%E5%AE%B6%E4%BA%BA%E8%88%AC%E7%9A%84%E5%AF%8C%E9%82%A6%E6%82%8D%E5%B0%87-ft-%E5%AF%8C%E9%82%A6%E6%82%8D%E5%B0%87%E7%AF%80%E7%9B%AE%E4%B8%BB%E6%8C%81%E4%BA%BA-anu/id1575840527?i=1000558366564