並前往https://podcasts.apple.com/gb/podcast/ep-18-%E8%B6%85%E5%BC%B7%E7%84%A1%E8%8F%9C%E5%96%AE%E6%96%99%E7%90%86%E7%99%BB%E5%A0%B4-%E6%95%B4%E5%80%8B%E5%9A%87%E5%88%B0%E4%B8%8D%E8%A1%8C/id1514420753?i=1000476818179